#142-The Business of Happiness with Tarryn MacCarthy
John (Intro): I have been on a quest to learn everything I can about leadership obsessed with what makes the best leaders so good. After running companies small and large for the last 20 years, today I speak on stages all across the world to audiences who are interested in that same question. My name is John Laurito and I’m your host. I invite you to join me on this journey as we explore this topic: What makes the best leaders so good? Welcome to Tomorrow’s Leader.
John: Hey, there Tomorrow’s Leaders. I have got Tarryn MacCarthy on the show today. I think you’re going to love her. She was a host of a podcast that I was on maybe five months ago, four months ago called The Business of Happiness. And she’s a really successful entrepreneur, runs an orthodontics practice in Invisalign practice. She’s in the top one percent in the country in four years. So a very successful business leader. I love her perspective on what it takes ultimately where happiness comes from. So we kind of had this great natural conversation about all kinds of different topics. I think you’re really going to like it. So here she is.
John: All right. Welcome to today’s episode of Tomorrow’s Leader, where we dove deep on all things leader-related, related to leading yourself and leading others. I’m John Laurito, your host today with a fantastic guest. I’m really thrilled to have Tarryn MacCarthy here. You may remember and even recognize her because we’re doing a little bit of the swap today. We’re switching roles. I was on her podcast. She has a fantastic podcast called The Business of Happiness. And we’ll talk about that as well as her great, great success as a leader in the orthodontic field. So, Tarryn, welcome to the show.
Tarryn: Thank you so much for having me. I’m so honored to be here, John. Thank you.
John: Great to talk with you again. I love their conversation we had a few months ago. So this is part two now. And I get to ask the questions and find out all about you. There you go. Yeah. So let’s start off. You know, I’d love to start off with the business of happiness, because I think your podcast is terrific. And I know there’s some meaning behind that, of course. And it’s picked up and you’ve built a big audience in a short period of time. Let’s start with that. How did you get into it and what’s the goal? What are you trying to do and what your vision with it?
Tarryn: Well, thanks. Thank you for asking. You know, it’s interesting, I started out my career as a dentist, an orthodontist, and I have had this single-minded vision of what success looked like. And, you know, I remember kind of pushing through dental school. That was my goal to be a dentist. I was attracted to dentistry from the science aspect and the artistry of dentistry, but also the leadership aspect of it, you know, having your own business and leading a team, the entrepreneurial side of dentistry. So my 20s were putting my nose in the books and getting it done. And I realized that was one of my superpowers. If I just showed up every day, I could outwork anybody. And that’s really what I did for my entire 20s. And with this goal of becoming a dentist and hanging that shingle, you know, and opening my business and realizing or hoping that I would realize success when I did that.
Tarryn: And, you know, after pushing and pushing and finally creating a business and leading a team and graduating from dentistry and then an orthodontic residency, I felt completely unfulfilled and didn’t feel like a success. And I had the house and I had the
practice and I had the fancy car and it just was wholly unfulfilling. And I thought, oh, that’s right, success is having a family. So I thought, OK, now let me also have a family. And because I had neglected my body for decades in this pursuit of a career, I had a hard time conceiving. And so that became the next thing that I was just going to push through and persevere. And when we finally had a family, I still felt completely bereft of fulfillment.
Tarryn: And that, you know, that realization of I’ve got all the things I’ve got everything society told me I should have, why am I not feeling happy? There is a lot of shame tucked in there as well. You know, here I am sitting in opulence. I’ve got all the fun, fancy stuff, and I’m just so unhappy. And I think the moment when the business of happiness was born was it was a morning after an evening when I’d come home from working all day, seeing patients all day. And in the orthodontic world, if you don’t know, we see anywhere from 30 to 100 patients a day and we are on all day long. I’m on stage all day long with my patients. I was like, oh, it’s exhausting. And you’re running a business and you’re leading this team of women and you’re wearing many hats. And I was exhausted and stumbled home, stood in front of the pantry and gobbled down whatever I could stuff into my face, and got dinner ready for the kids. And, you know, constant resentment of my team needed me all day. My patients needed me all day. Now my kids need me all day, all night together.
Tarryn: Finally, after feeding everyone, drowning my sorrows in a couple of glasses of wine, and I remember it was my daughter was about four, and I just kind of asked her to put herself to bed because now I’d been a couple of glasses in and I was on the couch just exhausted and wanting to escape. And it wasn’t that night. It was definitely the next morning when I realized that I was teaching my daughter what success looks like and what that was, was pushing and pushing and giving of yourself all day, exhausting and draining yourself, stuffing yourself with food or alcohol, or at one point excessive exercise and having nothing left for my family and then getting up and doing it all over again tomorrow.
Tarryn: And I realized that there has to be more to life than this. I had achieved my dream. I was successful. I had a team. I was leading, you know, whole groups of women and leading my community and literally putting smiles on children’s faces every day. And I was miserable
and I realized so many of my colleagues were in a very similar situation. I looked around and, you know, dentists have the second-highest suicide rate of all professions. You know, we bounce up and down. We fight for the top five from year to year. And I realized. I know. Isn’t that amazing? I know, and there are the wealthiest professions, too. And I looked at my colleagues and I saw men and women who were leading whole teams doing amazing things, real influencers in their communities, making a real impact on people’s lives on a daily basis. And they are miserable and scared and shameful because they feel that way. You know, they have the second home and the yacht and some of us have airplanes and everybody’s really upset.
Tarryn: That’s where The Business of Happiness was born is trying to find out how we infuse fulfillment and happiness without having to burn the house down, without having to destroy what we’ve been working on for decades. How do we make this business? Great. You know, the one thing about dentistry that’s unique is we spend millions on our education,
millions. So for a student to graduate from dental school with a million dollars of student loan debt is not unusual. It’s a daily occurrence. How much it is worth. An interview in January with a student, several students at Tufts University. We were asking them what their student loan debt was and they said most of them had taken out for 2020 just for that year. $130,000 for their tuition only. Oh, my gosh. That’s not living expenses. That’s not food. That’s not your apartment that you’re renting. It’s just for their tuition. And I think their student fees and their books.
Tarryn: And so you can imagine when you get to the end of your schooling and you have not one patient, you don’t even have a practice. You don’t even have a job. The fear and the sense of lack are overwhelming. And you start your career that way. Yeah, and many dentists don’t have the option to just decide this is not for me. I’m going to be a yoga instructor. You know, let me just change careers. So that’s where the business of happiness started. I thought there’s got to be a way to infuse that fulfillment and redefine success for ourselves. And what does that look like without having to get rid of everything and start scratch, start from scratch in another profession?
John: Yeah, so. So and I love that. And you bring up so many great points because what came to mind is a lot of people that I know personally as well as myself at different periods were just like you, it seemed like from the outside, you’ve got everything and everything is running well and everything is working well, but you’re not happy. And I live, on the other hand, experienced myself and seen people that really find it. And when they do, it is absolutely not surprisingly, it’s life-changing. Yes. What have you learned? So in interviewing people and talking to people and doing this podcast, what have, you learned about it? And how does somebody do it? How does somebody get there?
Tarryn: You know, it’s a fascinating question. And this mission of mine is ongoing. But I’ll tell you what I’ve discovered is it’s unique to each one of us and that really the problem arises when we try to assume someone else’s definition of success and that the only person who can create that definition for you is yourself. And it’s an interesting journey. I love the story. You know, I’m from South Africa originally and my father, all generations and generations from South Africa. So my father grew up very poor on a farm in South Africa. In fact, they were so poor that they didn’t always have shoes, so they shared shoes. But between the brothers and, you know, one day it would be your turn to wear them one day, be your turn to wear them.
Tarryn: And on this farm, they ran down a long dirt driveway to get to the bus stop. And the trick was the game was to get your brother, who was wearing the shoes for the day to step in cow manure on the way to the bus stop because he’s the one that would then have to take the shoes off. So then we were all even and everyone had to go to school without shoes on. And what was so fascinating is years, decades later, when they sold that farm, that farm in that part of South Africa was on an enormous diamond mine. They literally, as they were running to school, trying to get each other to step into cow manure, were running on top of diamonds.
Tarryn: And I love that story because what it tells us in such a beautiful metaphor is that all of that is within each of us. And we might be living this very surface-level idea of success or even borrowing someone else’s definition of success. And the only way to find out what is.
Truly meaning for you, meaningful for you, is to dig down and find it for yourself and ask yourself those important questions of what is important to me and what are my values. And if just because someone else has a business that makes a certain amount of money is that important to me in my life, does it matter if I have a boat, if I can never get on the boat to enjoy my time there because I’m working so hard to pay for the boat?
John: Yeah. Yeah. Know it’s almost like and I see a lot of people where it becomes I was talking to somebody very, very recently about this just the other day about the progression from when somebody starts to do well financially and make more money and they adjust their lifestyle and it then goes from one level to another to another to another, and it becomes this very dangerous path because in order for them to maintain that level of happiness or become happier, they feel like they’ve got to increase their lifestyle. It’s a trap. People get into if somebody’s traveling and they’re used to flying on codes and they’ve never been on a first-class flight to go in first class, it’s amazing. And then somebody might adjust their lifestyle and have the financial means to travel first class all the time and great for them.
John: But then going back to coach is a miserable experience. And yet at the same point, at one point, that made them very happy to be able to take a trip somewhere. I don’t care where I sit. And then it’s not even first-class is enough. It’s got to be some kind of private transportation. So and the way the person explained it to me was you just there’s no end in sight. Yeah. You’re with you you know, you’re surrounded by friends that are doing the same thing. And, you know, before you know it, somebody’s got a helicopter and you’re feeling like, OK, well, now the next thing is and it was really it was a very sad conversation, but absolutely.
Tarryn: And that’s what I see with so many people. And it’s almost like you forgot to give yourself permission to change your mind. You forgot along the way to give yourself permission to think a little bit differently and to pivot and redesign. It’s almost like success holds us back from trying something new. You get to a certain level of success and you’re too afraid to change. So you just keep going in that direction. Yeah. And, you know, that’s another concept that I find so fascinating is the more successful people become, it’s almost like the more afraid they are of trying something new or of altering their path.
Tarryn: And the fascinating thing is when you allow yourself to do so, you become even more successful. It’s the one skill that real people who have achieved great success are so good at is being able to fumble and fail and try something new and maybe lose it all, but be able to think a little bit differently and reevaluate. Is this really important to me and what matters to me in terms of my own happiness and what is not? What is the expectation that I have of myself, but what is really important to me?
John: Yeah, and I remember a time, and this probably as many people that are listening can appreciate this. I remember a time where I would wake up on Sunday mornings and I would be dreading work the next day. I first thought that went through my mind and I guess I got to
not enjoy Sundays because it was one day closer to Monday. Yeah, I’m thinking, OK, how many other people are caught in that? And I did something about it. So I love every day and I’m happy as can be now. But I, I know and to your point, you know, sometimes people feel trapped because of the financial success that they’re having and it’s a path that they’re on. They just don’t want to get off.
John: But what are the what about the person that may not even be having success? You see people that are not happy in their careers and it’s a career that they know is leading them nowhere. It’s not even giving them the financial rewards or they’re not happy in a relationship and they know it’s not a relationship that’s healthy. What about that person? Why do people still feel stuck in that situation?
Tarryn: It’s a fascinating question. And, you know, it’s interesting in positive psychology research, it shows that if you have happiness, if you can work on your happiness or at least your positive perspective on a daily basis, those people that have those habits tend to find greater wealth, greater success, love in their life. Additionally, which is another interesting part of our success algorithm. But it’s not the other way around. You know, we were told that if you achieve this, if you get this, if you have this job, then you’ll find happiness and it’s really the other way around.
Tarryn: So it starts with working on your own inner fulfillment, and there’s this delicate balance that I like to think of, and it’s true for leadership of a team, but also leadership of your own dreams of humility and enormous self-respect. You know, I was talking about those diamonds that my dad was running on. That’s the magic that’s inside each of us. There’s an enormous capability within each of us. And I think some people just settle for something, whether they’re settling for a job that’s not very fulfilling and doesn’t bring in a lot of income or they’re settling for an enormously wealthy position, a very high salary for their position. But they’re not happy and then they just settle for it because they are missing that self-respect and that understanding that there’s a greater capability with the inside of them, but also the humility of just understanding that I’m like everyone else. And I think we all want so badly to be special and we all are. But at the same time, we’re all the same and we’re all capable of something great.
John: I like that humility and self-respect. I want to talk more about that. You remind me of a story that I heard Jim Carrey, the comedian’s father, and Jim Carrey tell. Now, if you’ve heard it, that his father was significantly more funny than Jim Carrey was, but his father got stuck in
a dead-end job as an accountant and never had the, as Jim Carrey says, the guts to get out there and actually try and do something with it. But he said he was far and away more talented than I ever was. And I learned all my humor from him. And ultimately his dad got let go and downsized and was faced with some financial issues for many, many years.
John: And one of the quotes that Jim Carrey came out with, which I thought was fantastic. He said, you know, you have just as much chance of failing at something that you hate. Yes. As you do. So why not pursue it? You might as well pursue something that really makes you happy and that’s stuck with me. And I thought that that’s so true. There’s somebody to fill that experience, something that they hate or a relationship or live somewhere, whatever, but they’re not willing to do anything about it. And in reality, a great life or great career, a great relationship is out there waiting for them. If they actually did something.
Tarryn: You know, I’ll tell you a secret that not many people know. And that is, there are surgeons who have achieved enormous wealth, enormous expertise. I mean, really good surgeons who I would take my children to, who have everything that they could ever imagine then that you could ever imagine would bring them enormous joy. And they are wildly insecure and terrified. Every day they go to work, every day they feel like this imposter
syndrome is a huge, big boulder on the backs of so many people. And I know that on the health care side of things because those are the people who I speak to. And I’m sure it’s pervasive in so many areas, in so many different professions.
Tarryn: But definitely, if you think, well, I’m so insecure and I’m in a dead-end job and I just don’t have it to look for something greater or to seek happiness or to find help or to find support or even dream bigger than this. Let me tell you, there is an enormously societally defined, successful surgeon who feels exactly the same way. And that’s where that humility comes in. We’re all the same. But we all also have this unique ability within each of us to achieve something greater and to really strive and really achieve inner fulfillment.
John: Yeah, that’s great. That’s a great observation. And I think that it’s interesting because some of the people that I think outwardly seem the most self-assured and confident are actually also very insecure. So some people feel like, OK, just somebody that appears that way, they must be really confident that it’s not the case. I know it’s very insecure people that you would never guess that, but that’s really helpful to the humility to feel and understand that everybody is the same and everybody is feeling the same. And I really like that. And having self-respect understand that you’re capable of more and there’s something in you that and the way I look at it not only will make you happy, but it’s something that is other people. There are other people out there that will benefit from you being in a better place.
Tarryn: Oh, absolutely.
John: You know, that ripple effect of, you know, the influence that you have on those people around you. So that’s what excites me. And that’s leadership. I mean, that’s where you know what I do. And you do come into places. What comes into play is how do people influence people to achieve things and do things and get to places that they wouldn’t have gotten to otherwise.
Tarryn: Yeah, beautifully said. Yes.
John: And you’ve done it. I mean, with your practice, with your orthodontic practice in such a short period of time. And I’d love to pick your brain a little bit on that because I think there’s a lot of business owners and leaders out there that would love to hear that story. In four years, you built this thing from the ground up to be in the top one percent in the country of Invisalign
practices. Short answer, I’m sure, with a much more in-depth question. But our in-depth answer, how did you do that? What goes into it?
Tarryn: Well, you know, it’s interesting because I had a practice before. This is not my first orthodontic practice. And that first orthodontic practice that I did have was struggling, struggling, and I was a mess. That was that period of my life that I was talking about previously. And this practice, it’s the same as orthodontics. I still collect money the same way I still have patients pay on their credit cards. I still don’t negotiate with insurance. You know, all of the ways that I’m running the practice in terms of the business side of things are very similar. The orthodontics itself is very similar. And I have similar team members on my team.
Tarryn: But the one thing that changed was this focus on my fulfillment and empowering other people and empowering myself has been my number one value that I found out was so important to me. So when I looked at myself and I said, what do I want? What does success
feel like to me? To me, it was empowering others. And it’s so easy to see it. Now, when I say to you that what I do is I don’t straighten teeth, I empower people through their smiles. But just having that mindset changes everything for me because I show up to work now. And remember, I talked about being drained at the end of the day by being on stage all day and running so many different aspects of the business.
Tarryn: Everything I do fulfills me because I’m looking at it through a different lens because I recognized what was important to me. And the same is true with my team, because now I lead them because I’m empowering them to be their very best because it matters to me. So when a team member comes to me with a question or a proposal for a solution. I look at it as an opportunity to empower them further, and I’m so grateful for that opportunity and it doesn’t feel like it’s sucking the life out of me at the end of the day. So when I come home at night, I feel like my bucket has been filled all day and I’m able to be fully present for my family. And I don’t have to drown myself in alcohol or in front of the closet anymore.
Tarryn: And that’s where I mentioned that, that study in positive psychology, when you can tap into finding out what does make you happy every day, not just on the weekends, not just on a Saturday, which, by the way, if you’re only happy on the weekends and you’re robbing
yourself on Sunday from being so stressed out about Monday morning, as you were just mentioning, I did the math once and I gave myself Sunday afternoon to stress out and I thought, OK, if I’m just pushing through the week to get to the weekends and on Sunday
afternoon I start stressing out again. I’m only living one and a half days a week of enjoyment, which comes to 78 days a year. 78 days a year of happiness. Is that what I want to live for my life? And the rest is just slugging it out, pushing through, drowning myself in alcohol that night.
Tarryn: And I wasn’t willing to live with that. And it’s fascinating because what I found was when you can bring in that happiness every day, the wealth and the money just flows. My business is so much more successful. I attract similar businesses to work with. I attract patients who find value and the same kind of interaction, the value of the interaction. I attract the people who are willing to be a part of that journey with me, and that really has been the secret to our success.
John: Well, that is such an amazing point, because as you were talking, I’m thinking that, too. I’m imagining the team that you’ve built is probably a business filled with people that have the same attitude, mentality, and outlook on life that you do. And that definitely attracts strong people to a team which then attracts people that want to do business with you.
Tarryn: So absolutely. And it also pushes some people away, by the way. Yeah. You know, just like a strong magnet has to poll, there are some people this doesn’t work for. And I’ve hired people who don’t want to be empowered. And there’s nothing more frustrating than being in a situation where you don’t want to be empowered and your bosses are stuffing empowerment down your throat. You know, that feels very uncomfortable. But once again, that’s not her definition of success and she’s entitled to her definition of success. So you’re right, it attracts a very specific type of person and it puts all the same people on the right path. But you have to be brave enough to also deflect and they are going to be some people who it just doesn’t jive with.
John: So what about this? There are people, I think, that feel almost like they’re trapped by just the workload that they have. You know, I’m imagining some people listening and saying, you know what, I do need to change my life and what I’m doing and how much time I’m spending doing what and everything. And that will help. But they just feel like they can’t get out from underneath this big pile of work. And what do you have any advice for that type of person and how do they find the right balance?
Tarryn: That’s a really great question. It’s a really great question, I think. You know, habits, and that is a habit of telling yourself that you don’t have enough time. It’s just a Latin mindset of lack and then this situation of being time, just not enough time. And it’s a story that we tell ourselves so often, especially high achieving people who try to cram so much in one day. And I’m one of them. So I’ve been there. I know what that feels like. I know what it feels like to say I wish there were more than 24 hours in a day. And the truth is, time is not something that we have or don’t have. It’s not something we can actually own. And we create this false impression of time. And really what it is, is where do you want to put your focus and your attention and what is important to you for your own health and happiness is important to you.
Tarryn: Then you have to donate your energy to that place. You’re going to have to find a way to make time for that every day. It’s that valuable. Just like I was going to use the analogy of brushing your teeth. I mean, you brush it, you find time to brush your teeth every day. I hope I hope everyone’s doing that. But you find that time. It’s two minutes. It’s two minutes of brushing your teeth twice a day. That’s four minutes. You just do you just there’s no question it’s going to be a part of your day. So why can’t we give ourselves four minutes a day to talk to ourselves and find out what’s important to ourselves? And the thing is, it doesn’t happen overnight. Yeah, you didn’t get to where you are. It took me 40 years to create this stressed environment. I couldn’t just change overnight. It was going to take work, it was going to take time. But the thing is putting the value on it and recognizing how important it is and then seeking support. Well now that’s the big thing is finding help.
John: Yeah, it’s interesting. I remember a time in my career where I was working every Saturday. It was, you know, obviously full-time throughout the week and even in the evenings. And every Saturday I’d go in in the morning and work till one, two, three o’clock in the afternoon. And I remember through the week, I would say to myself consciously, I’d look at certain tasks and I’d be like, OK, well, that’s a good Saturday morning task. That’s good starting work. So by the end of the week, I had this big mountain of stuff there that would be done on Saturday and I got myself convinced to thinking that I needed Saturday. I can’t work Saturday. I have all the stuff.
John: But what I finally realized to your point that it’s not I wasn’t happy. I was doing the day and a half of trying to be happy and not happy the other five and a half days. And I finally made a decision. You know, I’m not going to work on Saturdays. And what I found that was surprising that I didn’t expect is I was significantly more productive in less time when I took that block of time out of my schedule. And that was not even an option. I had to get it done through the week. So it wasn’t that I didn’t get the stuff done, I did. I just fit it in during the week. So I talked to people all the time about that, that your productivity is not it’s not a function of the time. It’s not a block of time or number of hours and a punch in a clock.
John: It’s really when you give yourself interest in less time to do the same task. It’s amazing how productive you become and you could do it. And absolutely, it’s interesting. And you think about people that when they try to do a date night with their spouse or significant other or something like that during the week and they well, I can’t I end up scheduling things over. Don’t make. Yes. Protect that. If that’s something that’s important to you, don’t let that go and fill the business in around what you can do. Yeah.
Tarryn: And it doesn’t have to take a lot of time. You know, for me, I really emphasize for myself and for my clients finding happiness every day. I don’t ever want to put off my happiness again. I want to find fulfillment. I want to go to work and be excited to go to work. I want to find fulfillment in my work. So how do we infuse it every day? And when you’re starting out, you know, it’s a journey. Being patient with yourself on this journey is so critical, you can’t just say, well, I can’t feel happy, so I’m going to give up. It is very similar to a muscle that you keep having to flex in order to strengthen and infusing happiness every day, even if it’s giving yourself five minutes, if, or two minutes. Let’s take the toothbrush analogy. If we just give ourselves permission to have two minutes, minutes to ourselves to revel in that happiness, whatever that is.
Tarryn: And it’s interesting because sometimes we don’t know. And that’s when those vices step in that we talked about before in terms of excessive exercise. You know, that’s what I found was I would then go to a Crossfit class and just power through a Crossfit class because I got that hit of dopamine and the endorphins and that. Felt like happiness to me, but. Realizing what is really important to you and might be exercise, it might be a dream, it might be just giving yourself permission every day to dream of what is important to me. When do I feel great? What is it that actually matters to me? And there are several exercises that I do with my clients in terms of tapping into it. But the point is that it’s possible to find it is possible to lead a team to have a multimillion-dollar business, to do what you studied, and to find happiness. It is possible.
Tarryn: And this is coming from someone who thought there’s no way I live an overwhelming life. I’ve chosen this path. I’ve made my bed. I’ve got to sleep in it. This is my dedicated career now. I’ve created this business. I’ve spent millions of dollars on this. I can’t turn around. And this is just my lot in life. I’m going to have to live this way. I promise you, it can be different. There is a way to tap into what brings you inner fulfillment and the enormity of the abundance in the wealth that will flow to you subsequent to that is incredible. Just because it feels so much better. You’re so much more effective at what you do. You’re so much more impactful on the people you’re around and on your team. And it really is possible to change your mindset. And it takes some time and it does take some support.
John: Yeah, it does, without a doubt. But you’re absolutely spot on. And I found that myself that once I made the decision to really do what I was happy and what made me happy and what made me happy is something that I feel also makes an impact in the world around me.
That’s when everything starts to fall into place. It’s amazing. It’s not just one decision, but it’s a ripple effect from that decision. And a great quote that I love is you’re always one decision away from changing your life and people sometimes don’t think about that. But it’s true. It’s not ten decisions. It’s one. I love it. That decision changes one to another, and that starts the journey.
Tarryn: Yeah, that’s really beautiful. And in fact, that one decision changes other lives, too, which is really exciting.
John: Yeah. This has been great. I could talk to you for hours and you’re obviously a wealth of information, knowledge and I love your perspective. I know the audience is feeling the same way too. If they want to hear your podcast, why don’t you tell them where they can find it and when it airs and how often?
Tarryn: Well, thank you. Thank you for that. Yes. Please come and listen to the Business of Happiness podcast anywhere. Spotify, Apple Podcasts, YouTube. Check it out. And this is really the conversation that we continue there is reaching out to other business leaders, experts in their field, entrepreneurs, and finding out how they tap into this inner fulfillment in their career and in their lives. And leadership is a big topic in our discussions as well, because as you so eloquently say, John, that each of us is the leader of our own lives and our own dreams and our own successes. And I believe that strongly so. The business of happiness or on Instagram, reach out to me any time at the base of happiness and on LinkedIn and on Facebook anywhere. Look me up.
John: That is great. Well, we will have all your info in the show notes so people can check it out there as well. But I highly recommend people checking out Tarryn’s podcast. It is fantastic and it’s growing fast. I know not just here in the US. My guess is all over the place. Yeah, you got a big fan base out there.
Tarryn: Wonderful. Well, thank you again for having me on your show. I’m honored and so grateful to be speaking with you.
John: Well, thank you, Tarryn, and thank you everybody for joining in today. We’ve been with Tarryn MacCarthy, the Business of Happiness podcast. Check it out for sure. She is a successful business owner, entrepreneur and knows a thing or two about building a happy life. So make sure you like, share, subscribe. And of course, I always appreciate your comments below and your suggestions on future topics and guests. That would be great for tomorrow’s leader. We appreciate you joining us today. Go down below, give a five-star review, of course, and we’ll look forward to seeing you next time.
John (Closing): Thanks for joining us on today’s episode of Tomorrow’s Leader. For suggestions, or inquiries, about having me at your next event, or personal coaching, reach me at email@example.com Once again, that’s firstname.lastname@example.org. Thanks! Lead on!